Originally posted by Melvin Nasty: I like how even when you make it clear you're not jumping at the bit to see him fired, people still assume that's exactly what you meant. Did any of you actually read what I typed? And of course I realized that core would come to an end, but that still doesn't justify the mistakes he made with Flip and Curry, or the ridiculous Iverson trade for that matter. If these signings DON'T work out, which could be likely... will all of you still be singing the same tune? Nope.
Yeah, ban me and call me a bum for having an opinion that differentiate's from all of your's.
The rediculous Iverson trade just rebuilt this franchise. 1 down year is a sacrifice a GM must be willing to make. You basically raised the question "Should Joe be Fired". Forgive US all for unanimously smacking you in the face for suggesting so.
Yeah, this team is rebuilt alright.
Gordon and Villanueava aren't going to carry us anywhere.
Congrats on being naive.
Naw I just think the guy meant it took its first step in rebuilding the franchise. Get a quality big and a backup PF and we could be something special. Add in Avery and I'll be happy going into next year. It's only been one day of free agency and look how much Joe has accomplished already. Be patient man...
Look, don't get me wrong... I'm a fan of Grodon's and I do like the signing of Villanueava, but I don't see how both of those guys make this team betetr. What if they end up not working out? What if we don't get quality bigs, which we so desperately need? etc.
I would be happy with Avery as head coach, though.
Originally posted by Melvin Nasty: I like how even when you make it clear you're not jumping at the bit to see him fired, people still assume that's exactly what you meant. Did any of you actually read what I typed? And of course I realized that core would come to an end, but that still doesn't justify the mistakes he made with Flip and Curry, or the ridiculous Iverson trade for that matter. If these signings DON'T work out, which could be likely... will all of you still be singing the same tune? Nope.
Yeah, ban me and call me a bum for having an opinion that differentiate's from all of your's.
The fact that you, and others, are even thinking about it is laughable. And can we please stop the "He doesn't draft well" myth. If you actually look into it, he's been in the top 10 at drafting players. That's not great, but it is top 1/3. There are a lot of misses in the draft.
Lets see. He got an All-Star in the 2nd round with Okur. An Olympian and key piece to the championship in the late first round with Tay. Amir is way better than the avg. last pick in the draft. NBA experts think Stuckey is going to at least make an All-Star game at some point. Maxiel and Afflalo have been as good as the avg. player picked in the late first round (many late 1st round picks are not even in the league anymore). Maxiel even got more votes for 6th man of the year than any other big before Curry began using his minutes like a yo-yo. Even Delfino was a typical late first round pick, averaging about 10 ppg before bolting to Europe.
Joe D. has not had what could be called a "bad" pick in years.
Who does Okur play for now? That's right the Jazz.
Stuckey an all-star? Give me a break. If last year is any indication of what's to come, then he'll be nothing more than a bench player.
Max is overrated as well.
If you guys are going to act like this, at least try to NOT use fallacious arguments.
And you can have your opinion on Stuckey and Maxiel, but I agree with most of the experts and insiders.
Originally posted by Melvin Nasty: I like how even when you make it clear you're not jumping at the bit to see him fired, people still assume that's exactly what you meant. Did any of you actually read what I typed? And of course I realized that core would come to an end, but that still doesn't justify the mistakes he made with Flip and Curry, or the ridiculous Iverson trade for that matter. If these signings DON'T work out, which could be likely... will all of you still be singing the same tune? Nope.
Yeah, ban me and call me a bum for having an opinion that differentiate's from all of your's.
The fact that you, and others, are even thinking about it is laughable. And can we please stop the "He doesn't draft well" myth. If you actually look into it, he's been in the top 10 at drafting players. That's not great, but it is top 1/3. There are a lot of misses in the draft.
Lets see. He got an All-Star in the 2nd round with Okur. An Olympian and key piece to the championship in the late first round with Tay. Amir is way better than the avg. last pick in the draft. NBA experts think Stuckey is going to at least make an All-Star game at some point. Maxiel and Afflalo have been as good as the avg. player picked in the late first round (many late 1st round picks are not even in the league anymore). Maxiel even got more votes for 6th man of the year than any other big before Curry began using his minutes like a yo-yo. Even Delfino was a typical late first round pick, averaging about 10 ppg before bolting to Europe.
Joe D. has not had what could be called a "bad" pick in years.
Who does Okur play for now? That's right the Jazz.
Stuckey an all-star? Give me a break. If last year is any indication of what's to come, then he'll be nothing more than a bench player.
Max is overrated as well.
If you guys are going to act like this, at least try to NOT use fallacious arguments.
And you can have your opinion on Stuckey and Maxiel, but I agree with most of the experts and insiders.
I never said I'd make a great GM. But I guess I should expect the typical responses on here.
Seriously, do you all really believe Gordon and Villanueava will turn this team around? I'll gladly eat crow if they do, but odds are that is not going to happen.
And how many times do I have to reiterate that I'm not stating Joe should be fired? I'm simply implying that I can see within reason why some people are starting to down that route.
LEARN. TO. READ.
Pull your head out of your @ss and look at the big picture! If you are not stating that Joe should be fired, quit arguing points that indicate he should be!
Posts: 2948 | Location: Holt, MI | Registered: August 14, 2005
Originally posted by Melvin Nasty: I like how even when you make it clear you're not jumping at the bit to see him fired, people still assume that's exactly what you meant. Did any of you actually read what I typed? And of course I realized that core would come to an end, but that still doesn't justify the mistakes he made with Flip and Curry, or the ridiculous Iverson trade for that matter. If these signings DON'T work out, which could be likely... will all of you still be singing the same tune? Nope.
Yeah, ban me and call me a bum for having an opinion that differentiate's from all of your's.
The fact that you, and others, are even thinking about it is laughable. And can we please stop the "He doesn't draft well" myth. If you actually look into it, he's been in the top 10 at drafting players. That's not great, but it is top 1/3. There are a lot of misses in the draft.
Lets see. He got an All-Star in the 2nd round with Okur. An Olympian and key piece to the championship in the late first round with Tay. Amir is way better than the avg. last pick in the draft. NBA experts think Stuckey is going to at least make an All-Star game at some point. Maxiel and Afflalo have been as good as the avg. player picked in the late first round (many late 1st round picks are not even in the league anymore). Maxiel even got more votes for 6th man of the year than any other big before Curry began using his minutes like a yo-yo. Even Delfino was a typical late first round pick, averaging about 10 ppg before bolting to Europe.
Joe D. has not had what could be called a "bad" pick in years.
Who does Okur play for now? That's right the Jazz.
Stuckey an all-star? Give me a break. If last year is any indication of what's to come, then he'll be nothing more than a bench player.
Max is overrated as well.
If you guys are going to act like this, at least try to NOT use fallacious arguments.
And you can have your opinion on Stuckey and Maxiel, but I agree with most of the experts and insiders.
Yeah, 'cause they're ALWAYS right.
Probably way more than Melvin Nasty.
I don't make many predictions, so your point is moot.
I never said I'd make a great GM. But I guess I should expect the typical responses on here.
Seriously, do you all really believe Gordon and Villanueava will turn this team around? I'll gladly eat crow if they do, but odds are that is not going to happen.
And how many times do I have to reiterate that I'm not stating Joe should be fired? I'm simply implying that I can see within reason why some people are starting to down that route.
LEARN. TO. READ.
Pull your head out of your @ss and look at the big picture! If you are not stating that Joe should be fired, quit arguing points that indicate he should be!
Yeah man, God forbid I try looking at this from YOUR perspective. No matter which way you slice it, the future of this team looks very questionable in terms of how well it will perform. This, obviously, falls on the shoulders of the GM.
But no, keep overlooking that I like Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueava, I'm just not blind, biased homer like most of you.
Quit your crying just because I refuse to be subjected to your asinine opinion(s).
Originally posted by Melvin Nasty: I like how even when you make it clear you're not jumping at the bit to see him fired, people still assume that's exactly what you meant. Did any of you actually read what I typed? And of course I realized that core would come to an end, but that still doesn't justify the mistakes he made with Flip and Curry, or the ridiculous Iverson trade for that matter. If these signings DON'T work out, which could be likely... will all of you still be singing the same tune? Nope.
Yeah, ban me and call me a bum for having an opinion that differentiate's from all of your's.
The fact that you, and others, are even thinking about it is laughable. And can we please stop the "He doesn't draft well" myth. If you actually look into it, he's been in the top 10 at drafting players. That's not great, but it is top 1/3. There are a lot of misses in the draft.
Lets see. He got an All-Star in the 2nd round with Okur. An Olympian and key piece to the championship in the late first round with Tay. Amir is way better than the avg. last pick in the draft. NBA experts think Stuckey is going to at least make an All-Star game at some point. Maxiel and Afflalo have been as good as the avg. player picked in the late first round (many late 1st round picks are not even in the league anymore). Maxiel even got more votes for 6th man of the year than any other big before Curry began using his minutes like a yo-yo. Even Delfino was a typical late first round pick, averaging about 10 ppg before bolting to Europe.
Joe D. has not had what could be called a "bad" pick in years.
Who does Okur play for now? That's right the Jazz.
Stuckey an all-star? Give me a break. If last year is any indication of what's to come, then he'll be nothing more than a bench player.
Max is overrated as well.
If you guys are going to act like this, at least try to NOT use fallacious arguments.
And you can have your opinion on Stuckey and Maxiel, but I agree with most of the experts and insiders.
Yeah, 'cause they're ALWAYS right.
Probably way more than Melvin Nasty.
I don't make many predictions, so your point is moot.
And I said he was top 10 at drafting, not that he was perfect. So you can look down on picking Okur, Tay, Stuckey, Afflalo, Maxiel and Johnson, yet there are about 20 other teams who have done worse and usually had higher picks.
I never said I'd make a great GM. But I guess I should expect the typical responses on here.
Seriously, do you all really believe Gordon and Villanueava will turn this team around? I'll gladly eat crow if they do, but odds are that is not going to happen.
And how many times do I have to reiterate that I'm not stating Joe should be fired? I'm simply implying that I can see within reason why some people are starting to down that route.
LEARN. TO. READ.
Pull your head out of your @ss and look at the big picture! If you are not stating that Joe should be fired, quit arguing points that indicate he should be!
Yeah man, God forbid I try looking at this from YOUR perspective. No matter which way you slice it, the future of this team looks very questionable in terms of how well it will perform. This, obviously, falls on the shoulders of the GM.
But no, keep overlooking that I like Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueava, I'm just not blind, biased homer like most of you.
Quit your crying just because I refuse to be subjected to your asinine opinion(s).
You brought up the subject, and I am arguing with you now. That is how a discussion/debate works. See, you raise a premature/ignorant idea, and I/we prove points. Points that you may or may not like. It's how message boards work. I know you've only been here a month, but take this thread as a learning tool. If you say/suggest outlandish things, you are more than likely going to get pounced on by more than one person in response. Forgive US for not seeing it YOUR way.
Posts: 2948 | Location: Holt, MI | Registered: August 14, 2005
I never said I'd make a great GM. But I guess I should expect the typical responses on here.
Seriously, do you all really believe Gordon and Villanueava will turn this team around? I'll gladly eat crow if they do, but odds are that is not going to happen.
And how many times do I have to reiterate that I'm not stating Joe should be fired? I'm simply implying that I can see within reason why some people are starting to down that route.
LEARN. TO. READ.
Pull your head out of your @ss and look at the big picture! If you are not stating that Joe should be fired, quit arguing points that indicate he should be!
Yeah man, God forbid I try looking at this from YOUR perspective. No matter which way you slice it, the future of this team looks very questionable in terms of how well it will perform. This, obviously, falls on the shoulders of the GM.
But no, keep overlooking that I like Ben Gordon and Charlie Villanueava, I'm just not blind, biased homer like most of you.
Quit your crying just because I refuse to be subjected to your asinine opinion(s).
You brought up the subject, and I am arguing with you now. That is how a discussion/debate works. See, you raise a premature/ignorant idea, and I/we prove points. Points that you may or may not like. It's how message boards work. I know you've only been here a month, but take this thread as a learning tool. If you say/suggest outlandish things, you are more than likely going to get pounced on by more than one person in response. Forgive US for not seeing it YOUR way.
You haven't proven any point, though. You're just some biased little homer who's mad because I look at both sides as opposed to just grasping on to any signing we make, and hoping that it ends up being our meal ticket. But if you wanna keep crying, please, continue to do so.
In some ways Joe has had good skill and luck. He is a better GM now.
From his interview he learned from the mistake of hireing Curry and will never expose a rookie coach to such things again...
Ever since the Darko draft, Joe has decided to not make that mistake again either. I mean, I have heard him talk about how intesley he scouts players and how much tape he watches on them.
He still will make mistake, but I think he learns from them and is a even better GM now than he was when he won the championship.
His best qulity is his ability to recognize when he has a good thing and and simply not mess with it.
Posts: 496 | Location: State College PA | Registered: October 31, 2005
This what ticks me off about these arm chair GMs like Mike Valenti and some people on here, no matter what Joe did they was going to whine about it. If Joe kept the team together and they end up losing to the Magic in the Eastern conference finals they would whine about Joe keeping this team together for another season but instead they whining about trading away a guy they wanted to run out of town after seeing him get lit up by Boobie Gibson.
Joe has earned the right to rebuild this team, he took a team that was dead in the water after Grant Hill left and made them a major player in the NBA for almost a decade.
I wish the people who compare Joe to Matt Millen or want him out tell me who do they want to replace Joe with.
Joe has done a very very good job as the GM of this team but I believe his talent is based off a very good eye for free agents and current players in the league.
I dont think he should be fired but I do think he needs to add staff in the front office to help evaluate draft scouting and also coaching.
I believe his drafting has been sub-par at best. It's sad when one of his best pics doesn't even play here but Utah instead.
Joe is a class act but everything he has touched has not turned to gold and on a side note can we all as Piston fans stop over valuing players that are on our roster. Amir is not the answer to anything in Detroit. The guy cannot stay out of foul trouble to save his life and to me he is just a younger version of Theo Ratlif.
Originally posted by Kidrock: Just wait and watch...C.V will prove to be an overpaid useless acquisition....
Took a right on Lyndale I'm getting near But then the road became empty and the people disappeared The clouds ran away, opened up the sky And one by one I watched every constellation die And there I was frozen, standin in my backyard Face to face, eye to eye, starin at the last star I should've known, walked all the way home To find that she wasn't here, I'm still all alone.
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