NBA NBDL WNBA FANTASY GAMES NBA TV STORE TICKETS HELP
Pistons.com Message Boards Terms of Use    Message Boards    Palace Sports & Entertainment Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  Detroit Pistons  Hop To Forums  Pistons Team Talk    Book: Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan kept Isiah Thomas off Olympic team
Go
New
Find
Notify
Tools
Reply
  
  Login/Join 
Superstar
Posted
Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan and other players conspired to keep former Pistons great Isiah Thomas off the 1992 Olympic Dream Team, Johnson admits in his new book.

"Isiah killed his own chances when it came to the Olympics," Johnson writes in "When The Game Was Ours," scheduled to be released Nov. 4.

Details of the book were reported by Ian Thomsen of Sports Illustrated. The book is co-written by Johnson, Larry Bird and Jackie MacMullan.

Added Johnson: "Nobody on that team wanted to play with him. ... Michael didn't want to play with him. Scottie (Pippen) wanted no part of him. Bird wasn't pushing for him. Karl Malone didn't want him. Who was saying, 'We need this guy'? Nobody."

Chuck Daly was coach of that 1992 team that won the gold medal at Barcelona. He was coach of Thomas and the Pistons at the time.

Johnson also accuses Thomas of questioning Johnson's sexual orientation after the former Michigan State star was diagnosed with HIV in 1991, according to Thomsen's report.

"Isiah kept questioning people about it," Johnson writes. "I couldn't believe that. The one guy I thought I could count on had all these doubts. It was like he kicked me in the stomach."

Thomas, now the coach at Florida International, responded to the book by telling Sports Illustrated: "I'm really hurt, and I really feel taken advantage of for all these years. I'm totally blindsided by this. Every time that I've seen Magic, he has been friendly with me."



quote:
Originally posted by The Original King Box Est. 1992:
everything on this message board is pointless.

 
Posts: 5381 | Location: Detroit, MI | Registered: December 13, 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
It was always odd how the best PG of that era was not chosen for the team. In his prime, Zeke did circles around Stockton.

Jordan and Pippen were just ****ed that someone did not bow down to the mighty Bulls and kiss their ***** every time they played them.



quote:
Originally posted by The Original King Box Est. 1992:
everything on this message board is pointless.

 
Posts: 5381 | Location: Detroit, MI | Registered: December 13, 2002Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

Funky Monkey
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
I don't think it's that much of a surprising revelation. There had been rumors for a long time Jordan had done this. Now it's just adding names to the fire like Pippen and Bird, but those names don't really surprise you either. It's only really Magic that is surprising. But in the quotes above, it doesn't really say that Magic didn't want to play with Isiah. He only named other players that didn't want to. Seems like it was more like Magic just went along with what everyone else wanted and didn't speak up for Zeke because of the sexual orientation thing.
 
Posts: 9069 | Location: Boogie Boulevard | Registered: July 22, 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
The Last Gunslinger
Veteran
Posted Hide Post
There was very little doubt in my mind that Michael Jordan had something to do with it. Magic shocks me, though. I've always heard that off the court they were pretty good friends.

If there's any consolation from Isiah being left off, at least most people today know and acknowledge that it was wrong.


-------------------------------------------
The man in black fled across the desert and the gunslinger followed...
 
Posts: 622 | Location: Following the Path of the Beam | Registered: December 05, 2004Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Sophomore
Posted Hide Post
bad things happen to bad people.
 
Posts: 186 | Location: get over here! | Registered: September 11, 2009Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

Funky Monkey
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
Sometimes. But good things happen to bad people too.

I think Michael Jordan is/was every bit of the a-hole Isiah is/was. That didn't keep him from being on that team or having the success he did.

I was a huge fan of Isiah growing up and I'll defend him as much as reasonably possible, but even I admit Zeke as a pr-ick. So was Michael, so was Bird. That was what helped push the competitive fire in those types of guys. Isiah never tried to make any friends on his way to trying to win games and titles. He just so happened to really bring out animosity in two of the game's greatest players in Jordan and Bird who had a lot of pull in things like this.


P.S. I also wonder if this is somehow related to John Stockton asking Isiah to present him at the HOF induction this year. Stockton knew Isiah deserved the spot over him, at least from a talent standpoint. Stockton wasn't part of that decision. If that had any bearing on that decision, I give props to John Stockton. That's a pretty nice gesture.
 
Posts: 9069 | Location: Boogie Boulevard | Registered: July 22, 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Rookie
Posted Hide Post
Welp, just makes me dislike Jordan that much more...
 
Posts: 55 | Location: Los Angeles | Registered: October 14, 2009Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Rookie
Posted Hide Post
After that hall of fame speech
I don't like him much either. I never did because I'm a Piston but there was a time when I would willingly acknowledge his greatness, but Jordan apparently is a petty and bitter jerk who gets off on revenge.
 
Posts: 5 | Registered: October 20, 2009Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

Star
Posted Hide Post
 
Posts: 1738 | Location: Wayne Manor | Registered: April 14, 2009Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

Funky Monkey
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
Some more, might be overlapping with the material in the original post.

http://m.si.com/news/to/to/det...12E8C810.cnnsilive9i

quote:
When he heard the criticisms from his former friend Magic Johnson in a soon-to-be-released book, Isiah Thomas said he'd had enough. And so he began to fight back.

"I'm really hurt, and I really feel taken advantage of for all these years,'' said Thomas, the Hall of Fame point guard and former NBA coach and executive, most recently with the Knicks. "I'm totally blindsided by this. Every time that I've seen Magic, he has been friendly with me. Whenever he came to a Knick game, he was standing in the tunnel [to the locker room] with me. He and [Knicks assistant coach] Herb [Williams] and I, we would go out to dinner in New York. I didn't know he felt this way.''

The criticisms are made by Johnson in When The Game Was Ours, which he co-wrote with Larry Bird and author Jackie MacMullan. The book, to be released on Nov. 4, tells the inside story of the most important rivalry in basketball history.

Much of their story involves Thomas, who as captain of the Detroit Pistons served as a primary threat to the championship ambitions of Bird's Celtics and Magic's Lakers. The book offers revelations that have stunned Thomas. Magic addresses years of rumors by finally accusing Thomas of questioning his sexuality after Johnson was diagnosed with HIV in 1991. Magic also admits that he joined with Michael Jordan and other players in blackballing Thomas from the 1992 Olympic Dream Team, saying, "Isiah killed his own chances when it came to the Olympics. Nobody on that team wanted to play with him. ... Michael didn't want to play with him. Scottie [Pippen] wanted no part of him. Bird wasn't pushing for him. Karl Malone didn't want him. Who was saying, 'We need this guy?' Nobody.''

"I'm glad that he's finally had the nerve and the courage to stand up and say it was him, as opposed to letting Michael Jordan take the blame for it all these years,'' Thomas responded during one of several interviews he gave to SI.com on Wednesday. "I wish he would have had the courage to say this stuff to me face to face, as opposed to writing it in some **** book to sell and he can make money off it.''

Thomas, who is the first-year coach at Florida International in Miami, confirmed that MacMullan attempted to reach him for comment six months ago, but he declined through his publicist to speak with her.

Magic's most shocking accusation, however, is that Thomas was responsible for spreading rumors that Johnson was gay or bisexual after Johnson tested positive for HIV, forcing his retirement at age 32. "Isiah kept questioning people about it,'' Magic says. "I couldn't believe that. The one guy I thought I could count on had all these doubts. It was like he kicked me in the stomach.''

Thomas vehemently denied that he had gossiped behind Magic's back, pointing out that he knew better than to engage in such hurtful talk.

"What most people don't know is, before Magic had HIV, my brother had HIV,'' Thomas said. "My brother died of HIV, AIDS, drug abuse. So I knew way more about the disease, because I was living with it in my house.''

His brother, Gregory Thomas, died five years ago, Isiah said.

"Magic acted and responded off some really bad information that he got,'' Thomas went on. "Whatever friendship we had, I thought it was bulls--- that he believed that. Let me put it to you this way: If he and I were such close friends, if I was questioning his sexuality, then I was questioning mine too. That's how idiotic it is.''

The book's main source for this allegation is Magic's longtime agent, Lon Rosen, who says Thomas told him in 1991, "I keep hearing Magic is gay.''

"C'mon, Isiah, you know Earvin better than anyone,'' Rosen replies.

"I know,'' Thomas answers, "but I don't know what he's doing when he's out there in L.A.''

On Wednesday, Thomas denied that conversation. "I don't know Lon like that,'' he said, adding that he reached out to Johnson at the time. "I remember calling Magic and saying [of the allegations that he was rumor-mongering], 'You know that's some bulls---.' ''

Magic declined to be interviewed for this story. Rosen, speaking on behalf of his client, said he and Magic stand by everything attributed to them in the book.

Thomas insisted he felt too much sympathy for Magic to be spreading rumors about him.

"I felt awful for him; I felt awful for everybody,'' Thomas said. "But I knew enough at that time that he didn't have to retire. The 'blood' thing we do in the NBA -- where we stop the game because of blood on somebody's shirt and all that ceremonious stuff -- we're not stopping HIV/AIDS that way. We still do it out of some insane fear that came about when Karl Malone and everybody was saying they weren't playing if Magic was playing.''

Instead, Thomas said he helped make it possible for Magic to return in 1992 to the All-Star Game.

"They weren't going to let Magic play in the All-Star Game; all the players were coming out [against him],'' Thomas said. "You know how that all got turned around? I had a meeting with all of the players -- because I was president of the players' association -- and I told them not only was he going to play, but we were going to shake his hand and give him a hug. And I was the first to shake his hand and hug him and give him a kiss, to let people know that's not how the virus is spread.

"And you can go back and check at the players' association. Call Charlie Grantham [the former union executive director and COO] and ask him how Magic got to play in the All-Star Game. Ask him who called the meeting.''

When The Game Was Ours credits NBA commissioner David Stern with inviting Johnson to play in the All-Star Game, despite objections from some players and owners. The book does acknowledge, however, that Thomas was the first player to embrace Johnson on the court before the game.

"I don't discriminate," Thomas said. "I don't believe any race or ethnic group or social group should be discriminated against, because I have been discrimated against, and I know it would be wrong for me to discriminate.

"I think Magic has been misled on a lot of things, and unfortunately this has been another one of them. I am hurt and disappointed that he has chosen to believe others as opposed to his closest friends. And I think you can go back and look in that era and see who his closest friends were, and who his closest friends are now. At that time, I don't consider Lon Rosen to be one of his closest friends; he was one of his business advisers making money off him.''

According to the book, Magic at one time considered Thomas to be his closest friend in the league. Magic says their relationship changed during the 1988 Finals when -- in retaliation for the physical play of Isiah's Pistons teammates -- he clobbered Thomas as Detroit's captain was driving through the lane.

"When we got to the ['88] Finals, our relationship became very different,'' Thomas acknowledged. "It was OK for us to be friends when we weren't competing with the Lakers, but when we started competing with the Lakers, our friendship changed. I remember my son was born in '88 during the NBA Finals and Magic wouldn't even come to the hospital.

"So who kicked who? I'm sick and tired of being punched and people spinning stuff. You remember in Game 5 when Magic gave me a forearm shiver while I was in the air? I got up and pushed him, and what everybody wrote was that Isiah pushed Magic [to start the incident].''

After Thomas suffered a severe ankle sprain in Game 6 of that series -- he set an NBA Finals record with 25 points in the third quarter despite the injury -- the Lakers refused to let him use their training facilities, he said. "I tried calling Magic on the phone and he wouldn't take my phone calls,'' said Thomas, who got help from an unlikely source, the Los Angeles Raiders.

"Al [Davis, the Raiders' owner] called Chuck [Daly, the Pistons' coach] because they were close, and he said, 'Screw the Lakers, you can come and use our facilities.' I had to get treatment at the Raiders' facility because Magic and the Lakers wouldn't let me use their ultrasound, hot tubs and whirlpools. I tried calling him to see if he could talk to the trainer, and he wouldn't pick up the phone.''

Magic admits in the book that his relationship with Jordan was permanently chilled by allegations that he was involved in a plan to keep the ball away from Jordan and freeze him out as a rookie in the 1985 All-Star Game at Indianapolis. But Magic is adamant that he had nothing to do it, which effectively leaves Thomas stranded as the engineer of the alleged plot.

Thomas has long denied that he had anything to do with the anti-Jordan conspiracy while doubting that it ever happened.

"The whole thing is so absurd,'' Thomas said. "If Sports Illustrated would just review the game -- get a tape and watch that game and tell me where I was supposed to be freezing out Michael Jordan.''

If Jordan didn't receive a lot of passes -- he scored seven points while attempting nine shots in 22 minutes -- then it was because the team had other priorities, according to Thomas.

"I know people think that Michael Jordan is the best player now, but at that time, he wasn't the best player,'' Thomas said. "At that time, we were better than he was. It's not like he got the rookie treatment. Somebody is going to tell me I'm not going to [pass to] Bird and Moses [Malone] and Dr. J [Julius Erving]? It was a big thing, me playing an All-Star Game in Indiana. I went to school there. Larry Bird went to school there; he was from there. I'm sorry David Falk [Jordan's agent] didn't like that.''

Interestingly, Bird has nothing bad to say about Isiah in the book, even though at one time Thomas was accused of saying that Bird was overrated because he was white. Bird, who is now president of the Indiana Pacers, fired Thomas as coach in 2003.

"Let's be real. I'm not going to say the things Magic said in private about Larry, but I do know the public stance he's taken [in becoming Bird's friend]," Thomas said. I know that's not how he felt about Larry Bird. Magic hated Larry, and he tried to make other people hate Larry. Magic was no friend of Larry Bird's during that time. And his Laker teammates will tell you that. And I'm sure they've got to be disgusted with the way he's carried on with this whole me-and-Larry bull.''

But that's another twist, as reported in detail by When The Game Was Ours: that the sport's most famous rivals -- Magic and Bird, who once considered each other enemies -- have grown to be friends, while the opposite has become of the relationship between Magic and Thomas, who famously greeted each other with a kiss on the cheek before each game of the '88 Finals, even as their friendship was souring.

The book tells the story of how Thomas and Mark Aguirre consoled Magic in his Boston hotel room as he stared out the window watching fans celebrating in the street after the Celtics beat the Lakers in Game 7 of the 1984 NBA Finals. Three years later in the same city, Thomas threw away Game 5 of the Eastern Conference finals when Bird intercepted his inbounds pass and converted the steal to Dennis Johnson for the game-winning layup. When told that Magic now recalls engaging in an hours-long soul-searching conversation with him after that horrible loss, Thomas sounded skeptical. After a long pause, he said, "Sure. That could have been possible.

"The guy who reached out to me after that play was a Celtic and it was Bill Russell,'' added Thomas, who took the call from Russell the day after the game. "I was down dead on my knees after that play. He just called me up and said, 'Hey, we all make the mistakes, you've got to keep playing.' And he said it the way only he could say it. You know who else reached out to me? M.L. Carr [a former Boston teammate of Bird's]. For as hard as we played against the Celtics, I think we had a very personal relationship with them. They admired that we were trying to be like them. And we all said, to this day, they were the team that taught us, and everything the Pistons were, we took from their playbook.''

Thomas also disagreed with Magic's assertion that he helped persuade Madison Square Garden Sports president Steve Mills to hire Thomas to run the Knicks in 2003.

"It's so hypocritical,'' said Thomas, who was replaced by current Knicks president Donnie Walsh in 2008. "There's this public person and then there's this b.s. person. There's Earvin and then there's Magic. OK, I understand you've got to sell a book. But if this is how you sell it, then who's kicking who in the stomach? And it's just like the line he perpetuated that he got me the Knicks' job. Oh, yeah? Ask [Knicks owner] Jim Dolan. Call Barry Watkins [the Knicks' senior VP]. That's a lie.

"You're talking about being two-faced? Magic says he put me up for the job, that he was showing up in hard times and telling me everything was OK. And I come to find out he's been the one stabbing me in the back. ... I'm really hurt and disappointed, particularly with the Olympic team, if he was doing that stuff.''

Thomas said Magic has never confronted him about the HIV rumors or his true feelings about their relationship. As recently as August, Thomas attended a charity event in Beverly Hills, Calif., honoring Magic, where he said they greeted each other warmly.

"If he was feeling this way, why was he shaking my hand and kissing me and acting like he and I were such buddies?'' Thomas said. "Why do you do that?

"People who know me and my family and what I stand for will laugh at Magic and his beliefs. I'm tired of getting punched and people using me because they think I'm not going to say anything. Those days are over. Game on.''
 
Posts: 9069 | Location: Boogie Boulevard | Registered: July 22, 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
AMEN ZEKE, the greatest little man ever!


-----------------------------------------------------
The team that can be successful is the team who can force their will upon the game. -Lindsey Hunter

Give them nothing! But take from them everything!-Spartan King Leonidas

quote:
Originally posted by tetris:
Stuckey and Bynum are currently playing with ***...
 
Posts: 5889 | Location: Longview, TX | Registered: June 24, 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Rookie
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Pimp in the Box:
It was always odd how the best PG of that era was not chosen for the team. In his prime, Zeke did circles around Stockton.

Jordan and Pippen were just ****ed that someone did not bow down to the mighty Bulls and kiss their ***** every time they played them.


I love Zeke, but he was not the best PG of the era. Magic was. Isiah was maybe the best player inch-for-inch who ever lived, with the heart of a lion, but he wasn't in Johnson's class. Which is not a insult. Very few were.

And if he really did say those things about Magic, that's pretty messed up. They were supposed to be great friends. Why pile on when the man is going through the fight of his life? I'm glad to hear that he has now denied those rumors. Who knows what he said at this point, but what would have been his motivation to say those things?.

That being said, anybody who knows anything about basketball knows that Isiah deserved to on that team on merit.

Of course Jordan and Pippen didn't want him on the team. **** them. I don't think Pip deserved to be on that team anyways. His career bears out that he was in those players' league, but at the time he wasn't. Don't even get me started on Mullin.

And who really cares what that choker Karl Malone thinks? He wanted his boy Stockton on the team. Stockton was a great, great, great player, but he couldn't carry Isiah's jock. Put Thomas in his prime on those 97-98 Utah teams and they could have won those titles instead of serving as Chicago's *****es. Zeke was the vocal leader those teams desperately needed. When Bryon Russell is the only guy on your team with the balls to say anything, you're ******.

Karl Malone is a *****. I'll never forget that idiot putting the ball on his hip against the Bulls with the series on the line. So Jordan comes along and strips him (fouling in the process, but of course it wasn't called). Even little kids know when you are in the post, you hold the ball high. MVP my ***! I'm so happy he NEVER won a ring.

It sucks that the only REALLY big shot Stockton ever hit in his career was the one that kept us from a Houston-Chicago Finals. I was looking forward to that one.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: LongGun,
 
Posts: 44 | Registered: November 11, 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Veteran
Posted Hide Post
Now not only do I hate Jordan, but I also now hate Magic.
 
Posts: 668 | Registered: July 06, 2009Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Moderation
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
Magic is making one excuse for two excursions. Buy one get one free night at Magic's Theater. Throwing Zeke under the bus with his new book and with the Dream Team, behind closed doors. I heard he was talking about me. Wow.

I remember reading the News when the team was being selected. Pippen and Malone were the most vocal ones, talking mad greasy to reporters. Barkley was the only one that spoke up for Isiah, and he was uncharacteristically wishy washy when he did it. Now I see why. If Magic ain't backing him up, why bother?
 
Posts: 5378 | Location: your next stop | Registered: October 11, 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Moderation
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
-What made Magic completely sell out like this? Bird and Jordan, who Magic seems to want to be buddies with, never stuck out their necks for anybody not on their teams.

-I think Isiah Thomas is finally about to win a rare media battle.

-Thank God the Pistons kept Malone from getting his carpet bagger title. Poetic justice. He'll always have the Dream Team. haha
 
Posts: 5378 | Location: your next stop | Registered: October 11, 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post

Funky Monkey
Superstar
Posted Hide Post
Zeke does appear to have justification for his feelings on this one. However, it's still questionable whether he'd be able to garner much sympathy in the media. He's still definitely a punching bag for many.

I will say this though, while I do think Magic is grimy for this, I don't think either of them are completely forthcoming. Zeke was no saint now. And he probably isn't telling the entire truth either. It's likely that both of them said and did some shady things to each other. That's life. That's friendship. Sometimes friendships grow apart and grudges are held. It just so happens this one involves famous million dollar pro athletes that are in the public and a book deal.

I do think it was boolah for Magic to blast Isiah like this. No matter what hard feelings "friends" have, I don't think it's right to put another person on blast in such an extreme way. But, I guess he needed to sell his book.

Magic and Isiah were my two favorite players in the league growing up. Probably Magic 1a and Isiah 1b, but it was close. I loved watching both play. And, I thought it was cool that they were such close friends but fierce competitors. And, it definitely sucks seeing them bash each other like this.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Joe Jam,
 
Posts: 9069 | Location: Boogie Boulevard | Registered: July 22, 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Sophomore
Posted Hide Post
Magic's just mad he got caught packing fudge.
 
Posts: 354 | Registered: July 05, 2009Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Veteran
Posted Hide Post
Best Performance by a PG ever.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwoBSc4IzMA
 
Posts: 724 | Registered: March 23, 2009Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
  Powered by Eve Community  
 

Pistons.com Message Boards Terms of Use    Message Boards    Palace Sports & Entertainment Forums  Hop To Forum Categories  Detroit Pistons  Hop To Forums  Pistons Team Talk    Book: Magic Johnson, Michael Jordan kept Isiah Thomas off Olympic team

Copyright 2005 NBA Media Ventures, LLC. All rights reserved. No portion of NBA.com may be duplicated, redistributed or manipulated in any form. By accessing any information beyond this page, you agree to abide by the NBA.com Privacy Policy and Terms of Use. Employment opportunities
HOME | NEWS | PLAYERS | STATISTICS | SCHEDULE & SCORES | TICKETS
NBA NBDL WNBA FANTASY GAMES NBA TV STORE TICKETS HELP